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Osama Bin Laden Is Dead

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#21 iguanapunk   User is offline

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Posted 04 May 2011 - 10:07 PM

View Postigorchete, on 04 May 2011 - 8:43 PM, said:

Which government isn't seriously corrupt?
USA government is run by corporations.
EU government is run by fascists.


Yeah but the USA government is super corrupt. There's a little bit of stealing money out of hard working peoples pockets over here, but in USA they kill people for knowing too much, I saw it on 24 so it's fact.
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#22 mcmarsh   User is offline

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Posted 04 May 2011 - 10:37 PM

It's an interesting one whether the decision to kill him was the right one. I think if the US was to bring him to court the legal process would probably take years and people would then complain of millions of dollars or whatever being wasted on ethical treatment of someone who ordered mass killings of thousands of innocent people. I suppose the US government will be criticised whichever option they go for.

#23 Krisper   User is offline

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Posted 04 May 2011 - 11:09 PM

View Postiguanapunk, on 05 May 2011 - 9:07 AM, said:

Yeah but the USA government is super corrupt. There's a little bit of stealing money out of hard working peoples pockets over here, but in USA they kill people for knowing too much, I saw it on 24 so it's fact.


Iggy! now I am worried for you, they are listening everywhere.They can hear our thoughts!
Further Remixed There's nothing else...

#24 BoywiththeGoldenEyes   User is offline

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Posted 05 May 2011 - 9:20 AM

View Postigorchete, on 04 May 2011 - 9:43 PM, said:

EU government is run by fascists.


that's a bit harsh IMO
love is all.

#25 GuerraRelampago   User is offline

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Posted 05 May 2011 - 11:46 AM

View Postmcmarsh, on 04 May 2011 - 10:37 PM, said:

It's an interesting one whether the decision to kill him was the right one. I think if the US was to bring him to court the legal process would probably take years and people would then complain of millions of dollars or whatever being wasted on ethical treatment of someone who ordered mass killings of thousands of innocent people. I suppose the US government will be criticised whichever option they go for.


This.

Terrorists don´t waste one second thinking "Oh, it is ethical to kill innocent people because this medieval and stupid ideology I´m following?". Fuck Bin Laden and fuck all terrorists. There isn´t a single one redeeming or romantic quality about being a terrorist. People (especially in Europe) should forget this kind of cheap demagogy. Anyway, USA has killed an icon but hasn´t solved anything. in fact, I think this will fuel more hate and troubles.


#26 iguanapunk   User is offline

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Posted 05 May 2011 - 1:20 PM

View PostGuerraRelampago, on 05 May 2011 - 12:46 PM, said:

Terrorists don´t waste one second thinking "Oh, it is ethical to kill innocent people because this medieval and stupid ideology I´m following?". Fuck Bin Laden and fuck all terrorists. There isn´t a single one redeeming or romantic quality about being a terrorist.


Yes but then do you want to be on the same level as a terrorist? I'm just thinking, it must be really hard for the Counter Terrorism Unit to pick up on chatter for intel because everybody is talking about it at the moment.
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#27 GuerraRelampago   User is offline

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Posted 05 May 2011 - 7:23 PM

View Postiguanapunk, on 05 May 2011 - 1:20 PM, said:

Yes but then do you want to be on the same level as a terrorist?


I´ve heard that mantra repeated so many times that it just means nothing.

Terrorists are blind, hateful, illogical, vengeance-filled individuals that don´t care about ethics, juries, legislations, etc... They´re plain psychopaths without any regard about human life, and they will keep killing if they´re given the chance. Or their sons, families if they die, it´s something genetic. Believe me, I live in a country with a history so full of injustices in this regard I´m just tired of that scum.


#28 The bloke off the internet   User is offline

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Posted 05 May 2011 - 10:07 PM

He'll never stand trial. Sure, that is justice.
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View Postinchemwetrust, on 12 August 2011 - 11:00 AM, said:

For those who haven't seen them, I only have one thing to say.....Ha Ha!

View PostThePumisher, on 04 September 2013 - 10:01 AM, said:

i didn't wear pants at home ;)

#29 BoywiththeGoldenEyes   User is offline

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Posted 06 May 2011 - 7:16 AM

View PostGuerraRelampago, on 05 May 2011 - 9:23 PM, said:

I´ve heard that mantra repeated so many times that it just means nothing.

Terrorists are blind, hateful, illogical, vengeance-filled individuals that don´t care about ethics, juries, legislations, etc... They´re plain psychopaths without any regard about human life, and they will keep killing if they´re given the chance. Or their sons, families if they die, it´s something genetic. Believe me, I live in a country with a history so full of injustices in this regard I´m just tired of that scum.



one man's freedom fighter is another's terrorist - where does the fight for freedom and liberation or any good matter end and terrorism begin? would you say members of "weiße rose" in germany or french résistance were terrorists because both of them would not care about the life of a nazi?

IMO one has to distinguish carefully and clearly on this matter. I do agree with you on islamist terrorism but not on terrorism at all.

in the german constitution there is also a provision granting everyone the right to resistance to certain powers/regimes in the country trying to abolish the basic standards of the german state, especially democracy. that right to resistance also gives permission to carry out a certain level of force - terrorism???
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#30 The bloke off the internet   User is offline

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Posted 06 May 2011 - 1:50 PM

I would have agreed with you if Ben Laden had been killed by Pakistanese or Afghanese common people. But he was shot by the american army, which had the means to arrest him ! Plus throwing his corpse into the sea and refusing to publish the photos is as useless as stupid.
Roses are red
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View Postinchemwetrust, on 12 August 2011 - 11:00 AM, said:

For those who haven't seen them, I only have one thing to say.....Ha Ha!

View PostThePumisher, on 04 September 2013 - 10:01 AM, said:

i didn't wear pants at home ;)

#31 BoywiththeGoldenEyes   User is offline

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Posted 06 May 2011 - 4:10 PM

View PostThe bloke off the internet, on 06 May 2011 - 3:50 PM, said:

I would have agreed with you if Ben Laden had been killed by Pakistanese or Afghanese common people. But he was shot by the american army, which had the means to arrest him ! Plus throwing his corpse into the sea and refusing to publish the photos is as useless as stupid.


whom are you agreeing with? actually I agree wit your opinion :)
love is all.

#32 iguanapunk   User is offline

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Posted 06 May 2011 - 7:50 PM

BBC Question Time had a debate last night which I thought was interesting:

http://www.bbc.co.uk...ime_05_05_2011/

I'll see if I can find an .avi so I can upload it for you non-UK viewers.
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#33 GuerraRelampago   User is offline

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Posted 06 May 2011 - 8:19 PM

View PostBoywiththeGoldenEyes, on 06 May 2011 - 7:16 AM, said:

one man's freedom fighter is another's terrorist - where does the fight for freedom and liberation or any good matter end and terrorism begin? would you say members of "weiße rose" in germany or french résistance were terrorists because both of them would not care about the life of a nazi? IMO one has to distinguish carefully and clearly on this matter. I do agree with you on islamist terrorism but not on terrorism at all.
But the two examples you give must be taken on a frame of a World War, it´s completely different of the Post-WW2 terrorism: nationalists, extremists, and now islamists. The case I know the most are the ETA separatists here in Spain (which share a parallel common history with the IRA): a lot of the terrorists aren´t even from the part of the country they are claiming for, and further psychiatric explorations had ended up explaining they´re nothing but brain-washed psychopaths! I know it´s a very complex question, but what I can´t stand it´s people defending them or believing their causes are worth taking thousands of lives and families.


#34 BoywiththeGoldenEyes   User is offline

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Posted 07 May 2011 - 9:42 AM

View PostGuerraRelampago, on 06 May 2011 - 10:19 PM, said:

But the two examples you give must be taken on a frame of a World War, it´s completely different of the Post-WW2 terrorism: nationalists, extremists, and now islamists. The case I know the most are the ETA separatists here in Spain (which share a parallel common history with the IRA): a lot of the terrorists aren´t even from the part of the country they are claiming for, and further psychiatric explorations had ended up explaining they´re nothing but brain-washed psychopaths! I know it´s a very complex question, but what I can´t stand it´s people defending them or believing their causes are worth taking thousands of lives and families.


I do agree with you to a certain extent, Germany used to have the RAF (left-winged terrorism). However, there is no real definition of "terrorism" so governments could just come up with an unjustified definition of "terror" if they fear their power was endangered(also see rebellions/revolutions in arabian states of this year). Most terror started with a certain not necessarily negative idea but one always has to judge the results of terror. However, i keep my opinion one's got to differ on what "terror" is and how to evaulate it.
love is all.

#35 BUFFETT   User is offline

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Posted 07 May 2011 - 11:15 AM

My problem with terrorist groups, apart from the obvious, is who the hell gives them the right to carry out atrocities in other people's name.I'm sure 95% of Muslims are decent upstanding folk but the terrorists claim to speak on their behalf.Bit like the IRA in my country, they didn't operate in MY name nor in 95% of the people here.One thing I can definitely say is this.There isn't a single NON psychopath in Northern Ireland who wants to go back to the way things were.

#36 GuerraRelampago   User is offline

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Posted 07 May 2011 - 12:28 PM

It´s interesting how you BWTGE brought the name of the White Rose as a example of "terrorists", when in fact, they were exactly the opposite of terrorism: a bunch of people with a strong sense of morals, that fought for their ideas with the words (without killing anyone!) and sacrificed their lives for them. You can see them as martyrs, since they were hardcore Christians. It is possible to change things with civilian actions.

So to my eyes ALL terrorists are the same, insert here the names you want: Al Qaeda, IRA, Farc, ETA, Baader Meinhof, italian Red Army, Carlos the Jackal, etc...

They represent the lowest spectrum of the human kind and if they get eventually killed you won´t see me shed a tear regretting how sad and unfair is they couldn´t stand a trial. I´ll be always with the victims.


#37 BoywiththeGoldenEyes   User is offline

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Posted 07 May 2011 - 1:12 PM

Well Guerra, you are only half right here: "Weiße Rose" was considered being "terrorists" by the Nazi Regime just because of their resitance actions. This is what I've mentioned earlier: it is very often governments ruling on who is a "terrorist" or which group is. For Russia, certain forces in Chechnya are terrorists - what do the people in Chechnya say? Pretty much of those would see liberation fighters in them.
And the 2nd thing gerading Weiße Rose is that they were linked (personal) to resistnace members in Germany that actually commit acts of force incl. trying to kill Hitler and some others (Else, Stauffenberg Group).
I do not want to justify terrorism here. I just want to make people aware not everyone who is called a "terrorist" really is one actually.
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#38 GuerraRelampago   User is offline

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Posted 07 May 2011 - 3:27 PM

i totally see your point, but this question is like a never-ending Möbius strip: if you applaud some terrorist actions (because you sympathize with the movement or whatever) then eventually some other group will do the same and you will be forced to applaud the same way, and this ad infinitum. Violence is violence, blood is blood: at the end all what you get is more rage, more pain and more trouble.


#39 The bloke off the internet   User is offline

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Posted 07 May 2011 - 7:39 PM

I'm not denying that he was a terrorist, I'm just saying that sending the army into somebody's home in order to shoot him ruthlessly in front of his children is not the best conception of "justice". May I remind you that the terrorists on the 11th september (and terrorists in general) also thought they were fighting for justice ?
This is not justice, this is excessive force and nothing else.

I won't praise his death in itself, cause he would have died anyway. Everybody dies. But I'll keep in mind that he was never arrested.
Roses are red
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And I will rape
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View Postinchemwetrust, on 12 August 2011 - 11:00 AM, said:

For those who haven't seen them, I only have one thing to say.....Ha Ha!

View PostThePumisher, on 04 September 2013 - 10:01 AM, said:

i didn't wear pants at home ;)

#40 BoywiththeGoldenEyes   User is offline

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Posted 08 May 2011 - 12:07 PM

View PostThe bloke off the internet, on 07 May 2011 - 9:39 PM, said:

I'm not denying that he was a terrorist, I'm just saying that sending the army into somebody's home in order to shoot him ruthlessly in front of his children is not the best conception of "justice". May I remind you that the terrorists on the 11th september (and terrorists in general) also thought they were fighting for justice ?
This is not justice, this is excessive force and nothing else.

I won't praise his death in itself, cause he would have died anyway. Everybody dies. But I'll keep in mind that he was never arrested.



he was also an old man. pretty much he got tired from fighting. I don't agree with OBL been killed but he would never have had a fair trial anyway.
love is all.
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