Jockey Slut interview

by John Burgess

October 1994 Issue 9





The Dust Brothers have been the talk of the town this year churning out

a wad of down tempo acid house records with big boots on and causing

riots wherever they DJ. John Burgess joins them at the Heavenly Sunday

Social before heading off to the studio to check tracks on the

forthcoming album.

Ed - "I think it's a bit ironic what we do"

Tom - "l don't think it's at all ironic."



James Dean Bradfield, Tim Burgess, Saint Etienne, Evan Dando, Liam and

Noel Gallagher, Bobby Gillespie and Paul Weller. Just a few of the names

spotted with a pint and a pie at the Heavenly Sunday Social, home to a

couple of hundred twenty somethings who have rediscovered the benefits

of lager, amyl nose-up and the buzz for aggro dancing, whooping and

hollering as their weekly hosts, Tom Rowlands and Ed Simmons, mix up

that heady brew that has been termed Trip hop' but is probably more

accurately described as Dust Brothers-esque.

If Oasis are the best thing to happen to rock 'n' roll in many a year,

the Dust Brothers are flying a flag with viva Acid House scrawled on it

in very large letters. Early 1994 was looking grim: twenty minute trance

tracks and deadly serious prose in the press, insipid pop handbag and

DJs, once heroes, immersing themselves in an industry that finds worth

in repackaged re-released triple pack crap, which is why 'Chemical

Beats' was the biggest shot in the arm for the tired, jaded and ripped

off. It was raw, it was tuff and it didn't fit in in anyones t o o l,

sand or hand bag. Suddenly '94 looked pretty cool.





Tom - 'We thought Chemical Beats was just an amazing tune and when we

got the test pressings of it and gave it to these people they just

didn't play it. Ed - " Then Darren Emerson, Andy Weatherall and Justin

Robertson starting playing it and everyone starting going mad over it.',

Tom - "That has gone down as a good record. A good end of night tune.

Good any time of the night tune. You can't follow it. What do you play

after that eh?" Ed - "Manic Street Preachers."

The Dust Brothers formed in a dark pub cellar sometime in 1992,

someplace in Manchester. Tom and Ed had always teetered on the cutting

edge of good music be it the Mary Chain, Schooly D, the Jamms, joining

the queue for the house fest at Nude or stage diving at Most Excellent.

They became the Dust Brothers by night DJing for fun rather than

financial gain. Naked Under Leather was the name of their club

attracting a hundred like minded souls to crappy 'venues' either above

or below pubs, claustrophobic and smokey with a strobe flickering for so

long that epilectics got bored of having fits and joined in the fun.

Special Brew was the narcotic as the Naked punters rejected the cities

abused drug culture and took to drinking with great verve before pogoing

to the sounds the would form a blueprint for Tom and Ed's studio work,

what they mix up on the decks is the spirit they capture on vinyl:

shouty hip hop with ruff arsed baselines the hooligan house sounds of

'baggy' and noisey down-tempo acid house records. And now they're making

an album.



Tom - "Making an album's a bit of a weird thing. More tracks.... Making

a dance album people actually want to listen to is difficult."

Ed - "With dance albums you usually pick off a couple of tracks you like

and that's it"

Tom - "Do not let our album gather dust"



Crammed in Orinocho studios in the Elephant and Castle, Tom and Ed are

on Day Three of a fortnights work on their debut. Titles flying around

at the time include 'Dopeness on a Pill', 'In Dust we Trust', 'Just

Dust' and 'Just Say Yo!'. On the floor are a pile of records that

include Mudhoney, Jungle Brothers, Three Johns, Mercury Rev, Sonic

Youth, Pavement, Sabres of Paradise. On the wall is a progress chart for

the albums ten tracks. From left to right it has the following columns:

'Working Title/ Drums/ Bass/ Anything Else?'the essential ingredients

for a Dust Brothers record. In the Drums column for a track called

'Jabba' is the criticism 'a bit polite on the hi hats' but the bass is

apparently 'pill friendly'. On the track 'Delik' Tim Burgess from the

Charlatans is pencilled in as a possible vocalist. Rubber Lips

apparently digs the Dusters and the feeling is mutual. The album is jam-

packed with samples, lots of guitar riffs thieved from indie albums

though hidden with much studio trickery to avoid the pay off. "l don't

think you should take people's main hooks or main ideas from their songs

but I Iike the idea you can have all these people jamming on your

record" Tom says of the art. Their engineer Dubby selects 'Jabba' for an

aural airing I write down 'acid hip hop, machine gun drums, guitar

breakdowns, tub thumping finale, more aggressive than S*M*A*S*H, music

for the jilted generation who still take X.' Bit polite on the hats

though...



Ed "Chemical Beats is described as trip hop, but to me its a techno

record in the mould of any techno record but it's got a chunky break on

it.

Tom "It's an acid house record.



The next track we hear is 'Delik' ("As in psychedelic" Tom informs).

Amidst the space noises is that ancient word 'Jackie' repeated over It

stops, it starts, it screams and it includes a middle eight of sheer

weirdness. There is, a lot more going on in the mix than on their

previous EPs. The only other tracks we hear today is Briefcase Boogie.

It is about two minutes long and features samples thieved from last

nights telly.



Tom - "I like things that are noisy"



The album is sounding very Dust Brothers-esque. It will delight those

that bought the EPs 'Fourteenth Century Sky' and 'My Mercury Mouth' but

will probably not silence their critics, those that think that all you

have to do to make a Dust Brothers record is pour some acid over a hip

hop beat, those that think all their records and remixes sound the

same., those that seem to have forgotten about the blissful 'One Too

Many Mornings' or 'If You Kiling To Me I'll Klong You'. It is an

accusation that riles them. "That's our style" Tom argues. " If you

listen to our Prodigy mix and our Primal Scream mix and say they are the

same then you're deaf. I like them. You should see how many we've turned

down. They say we've done too many remixes but I think they've all been

really good." "K-Klass have done about seventeen" Ed points out.

They've turned down Deelite, Fatima Mansions, Echobelly, Massive Attack

and Consolidated. Why do Consolidated want you to remix them?





''I don't know?" Shrugs Tom. "It's cool. Because we've got a bit of

attitude on our records"

"More than K - Klass" adds Ed.



It's probably to do with the fact that being music fans Tom and Ed have

taken up remixes for the Scream, Charlatans and the Manics. They like

pop music, its not some ironic gesture. It's also something they have

been criticised for, for not being part of the clique that think Rock n

Roll is dead because techno reigns supreme. The Dust Brothers are part

of the open minded school of thought that actually believe in that often

quoted phrase from 'Come Together': Music is Music..." It is this

widespread appeal and eclectic audience that could make the Dust

Brothers very famous indeed. People who like Richie Hawtin like the Dust

Brothers. People who don't like Richie Hawtin like the Dust Brothers.

When I ask Ed what will happen when they get really famous he shrugs "We

won't". Then he tells me this. '



We were the answers to a competition on Radio One. It was on the Evening

Session. There was a competition to win a ticket to a Big Rave and the

question was 'Who are Tom Rowlands and Ed Simons' and some girl in

Sunderland got it right and won.

"Big respect to her" says Tom.



They also went to the States back in July to Orlando. Thinking they were

just the promoters little whim they were surprised at how many yanks

knew 'Chemical Beats'. "We played live to 4,000 people. We had a rave"

says Ed. Tony Di Bart and Hyper Go Go had played at gigs before them so

it is no surprise that the Dusters were mobbed for autographs. The real

mckoy.



Tom and Ed are two kids from the right side of town coming on like

they're from the wrong. Fans of their scary brash noise probably

expected them to look like a couple of skate kids, tattooed and scarred

from hanging 'round the chippy late at night In reality they are more

likely to go Round to Saint Etiennes house for a cup of Earl Grey and a

bun. This is their appeal. Like Wiggs, Stanley and Cracknell the Dust

Brothers are more pop than anything else. The album will be a musical

collision of all the best moments they've absorbed over their

adolescence: 'Postcard Pop', 'Psychocandy', 'Yo Bum Rush the Show',

'Rhythim is Rhythim', 'Check Yer Head' packaged under a top pop title

like 'Dopeness on a Pill' with a carefully thought out sleeve that

combines their fascination with the urban and their middle class

backgrounds. They could shape up into the British Beastie Boys if

they'll let themselves. And if they could rap.



They've already got that Rather Be Somewhere Else/Bizarre In Humour

interview technique down pat. They have a trainspottery secret language

"Doing a Dave Angel" was Ed throwing up from nervousness before going on

stage. "Doing a Moby" was Ed going mad behind his keyboard. And Tom

occasionally drops into a mock street patois. "Summat Tasty" seems a

favourite term. "Super cooper trooper" another.



Tom " The album sleeve is of a nice girl in a field. With Dust Brothers

spray painted on her."

Ed "Nice girl with scrawling on her"



Tom "A mix of the urban and the Rose Cottage. It's important when you

buy a record, that it's a good thing to own."



Though the Dust Brothers have been lumped with the media-hype 'Trip Hop'

alongside some of the Mowaxers and the Strange Brew crew, they stand out

because of their sense of fun. They are charismatic and people notice

especially when DJing they might drop a Happy Mondays record aher a

scorching Schooly D track. Wherever they have DJed recently they turn

what could be quite a scary, abrasive, noisey set into an air punchin'

party. It's usually their own records that do the trick, that leave

punters gob smacked, convince the old 'uns to go out clubbing again,

that have Melody Maker going a bit over the top and comparing the Sunday

Social to Shoom.

Ed "We're young, we're friends we have a bit of a laugh. I think people

have tapped into that." Tom " What I think about our music is that it

has a human element, it's quite emotional but not in a Detroit emotional

way, it's got more sweatiness, more clubbiness."

Someone said you sound like you could do with another day in the studio.

And that's the point.

"Yeah. Things are quite messy, quite raw" Tom concludes "I like things

that sound a bit wrong"

The Dust Brothers - sounding wrong, getting it so right.



The Remixes



Lion Rock - Packet of Peace (Deconstruction)

Scary wailing wifey {as used on Song to the Siren) returns to add some

scary wailing during the breakdowns. A robot shouts "Lion Rock Sound

System!". The bass and the weird shit factor are both cranked up high.

The laidback MC Buzz B is forced at knife point to join in at the end.



Ariel - T Baby (unreleased Deconstruction)

Tom's old balearic band gets the Brothers overhaul with some live stop/

start bass-playing from Thomas. You can hear his fingers scraping along

the bass strings. Cool. Jon Pleased Wimmin used to play this.



Swordfish - The Get on (Pandephonium)



Leftfield/ Lydon - Open Up (Hard hands)

Bettered Weatherall's mix and overshadowed the original. Snatches of Mr

Rotten, big beat breakdowns and guitar powerchords. In a scary minor

key.



The Sandals - Feet (Open Toe)



Primal Scream - Jailbird (Creation)



As played by The Scream at Reading (from DAT). A bassline gets pissed

and gets a tattoo with 'sleaze' etched on its arm. Bobby G is cut down

to a few 'Damn Rights!!' before some motor car horn shrieks in. Some

Hammond organ joins the shouty bit giving it a more uplifting, less

scary, rather partyish arms aloft vibe.



Deep Throat - Mouth Organ



Republica - Out of this World (Deconstruction)



Saint Etienne - Like A Motorway (Heavenly)



The winsome Ms Cracknell drinks Tom and Ed under the table insisting her

full vocal is kept in the the mix. Pete Wiggs snorts amyl whilst Bob

Stanley watches from side stage as the Brothers do their stuff.

Allegations of Dust Brothers mixes all sounding the same start to drib

in from stupid people.



Justin Warfield - Pick It Up Y'AII (Warner Bros)



Who Co-Conspired? Asks Justin. "It's the Dust Brothers!' replies robot

man from the Packet of Peace mix. A slow, low, funky ace-bassline driven

record. People fight to get a copy. That's an instruction



Charlatans - Patrol (Dead Dead Good)



Bomb the Bass - Bug Powder Dust (Island)



Prodigy - Voodoo People (XL)



Manic Street Preachers - La Tristesse Durera (Columbia)

Those were the days...

sneakerbeater Escribi�:

on Day Three of a fortnights work on their debut. Titles flying around

at the time include 'Dopeness on a Pill', 'In Dust we Trust', 'Just

Dust' and 'Just Say Yo!'. On the floor are a pile of records that

Dopeness on a Pill?

Just Say Yo?



Holy lord.

sneakerbeater Escribi�:

for a Dust Brothers record. In the Drums column for a track called

'Jabba' is the criticism 'a bit polite on the hi hats' but the bass is

Jabba. I'm sure Lucas got wind of that. Hrm.

sneakerbeater Escribi�:

apparently 'pill friendly'. On the track 'Delik' Tim Burgess from the

Charlatans is pencilled in as a possible vocalist. Rubber Lips

At least Delik was available before Singles....

sneakerbeater Escribi�:

previous EPs. The only other tracks we hear today is Briefcase Boogie.

It is about two minutes long and features samples thieved from last

nights telly.

Briefcase Boogie... hrm... not too bad...

sneakerbeater Escribi�:

Tom " The album sleeve is of a nice girl in a field. With Dust Brothers

spray painted on her."

Ed "Nice girl with scrawling on her"

Too bad we never saw this sleeve. Sounds interesting.



I wonder what songs those early "drafts" turned into....? Hrm. Like.. Delik eventually turned into Life is Sweet.

Briefcase Boogie sounds like it could be Playground for a Wedgeless Firm...



I'd love to know what Jabba turned into - sounds awesome!

Afro88 Escribi�:

Briefcase Boogie sounds like it could be Playground for a Wedgeless Firm...

I'd vote for that.... Playground does sound a lot like snippets from the TV. Plus it's close to 2 min long.

DELETED

Hehehe, I can't believe I missed that - psychedelik! X-D



Oh, and thanks for the transcript Sneaker 8) If you (or anyone else for that matter) has any other old interviews from the EPD/Dust Brothers era, please, feel free to post them. I love reading about the brother's early days, how they got started and all that. :D

jabba was the working title for 3 little birdies down beats

really cool interview sneaker thanks for that. the old track names are interesting and is jabba in reference to star wars

hehe, Tom and Ed could very well be Star Wars geeks! How cool is that? 8) Another endearing quality, if it's true. Probably best not to deal with Lucas' lawyers anyway.



And Dopeness on a Pill. Gotta love the clever song names.



sneaker, thanks for posting this article, it's a gem. It seems to capture the raw excitement of a scene just bubbling under the surface, 2 young men already on their way and already positioned on top of the game.



I wonder, what was the first ever Chemical Brothers (or Dust Brothers) interview - or is this it?

whirlygirl Escribi�:

sneaker, thanks for posting this article, it's a gem. It seems to capture the raw excitement of a scene just bubbling under the surface, 2 young men already on their way and already positioned on top of the game.

Totally true. i love the

"When I ask Ed what will happen when they get really famous he shrugs "We won't"." just like they dust brothers thing, like "well, it's the name of american producers, but we are not gonna be famous anyway, so who cares?"

wicked interview, outstanding find sneakerveater 8)



i really miss jockey slut :'(

whirlygirl Escribi�:

I wonder, what was the first ever Chemical Brothers (or Dust Brothers) interview - or is this it?

no, their first interview was in jockey slut in 93. i think this interview was from their first front cover magazine artical.

mippio Escribi�:

wicked interview, outstanding find sneakerveater



i really miss jockey slut

it was a good little find!! i really enjoyed this artical, it comes from probably the most exciting time of the band. where they are on the verge of true greatness!! i think their excitement of their music shines through!! but then again they have always been enthusiastic about their music!!



what has happened to jockey slut?? did i hear it was now a quarterly magazine?? i must admit i haven't bought it for a couple of years.

Yeah, what happened to Jockey Slut? I used to buy that mag every month, but all of a sudden they store didn't sell it anymore and neither did any other bookstore.

Wow, thats a great read sneaker, well done for finding it.

quote:

The only other tracks we hear today is Briefcase Boogie.

It is about two minutes long and features samples thieved from last

nights telly.

I was thinking the track is Chico's groove, but its longer than 2 minutes.

nice interview i really like the name "jabba". but there is already too many javas in the world.

This is a fascinating read, probably because it's from the earlier days. I liked reading about how they set about making the album and the soon to be rejected cover. I really enjoyed the bits about the remixes too.

sneakerbeater Escribi�:

jabba was the working title for 3 little birdies down beats

Did they say this in an interview? 3 birdies is pretty long... What about beats for breakin? That's shorter, and way more wacky beats...?

no it wasn't mentioned in the interview. but i know jabba was the workin title to 3 little birdies downbeats. there is no need to question what i write!!! i'm sure if miloco2forum passes by this thread he can confirm this

It makes sense. 3 little birdies down beats has machine gun drums, guitar stabs, the hiphop tempo, "pill friendly" bass and a mad ending.



The main reason I reckon breifcase boogie is pfwf is because I heard they recorded the audio from the tv through their ems synth, which just happens to be a synth in a breifcase :)